Curse

Cacheelma · Feb 15, 2009, 03:47 AM // 03:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Age

I could go further but those who are playing WoW are probably doing it out loyalty and dedication.They have invested a lot of hrs on thier accounts and aren't ready to abandon WoW.It could be the same for GW as we are abanding the time and energy we put into our accounts.

Not entirely true. How much hours do you think I'd spent with GW? I dropped it like a hot potato when I saw the chance to play something much much more fun.

I do the same thing with every game. What loyalty? It's more like retardation to keep on doing something that isn't fun anymore. And in case of WoW (or any other P2P games for that matter), you're talking about PAYING to do something you don't really want to do.

That's not happening.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crunk N Monkey

First its NO CONTENT. Now its ITS NOT ENOUGH.

its like a chick on her period who just wont stop complaining, no matter what.

How sexist of you.

Not enough content = No content, in my book.

And really, being a hormone-driven chick is better than being some kind of blinded bigot of whatever sexual orientation. Trust me.

Lasareth · Feb 15, 2009, 03:58 AM // 03:58

Games like Guild Wars are a lot more disposable than other MMOs though. Drawing a comparison between the two isn't exactly analogous.

Yeah people will keep playing a game they don't like simply because of their investment into it, that's just part of the psychology of it. It still applies to others even if it doesn't to you.

On the subject of the GW2 release, I've always been of the opinion that if you hype something up or build expectations too high, you will have made yourself quite the high hurdle to overcome on release day. While the fanboys (or to be more PC, the loyal fans) will of course eat up whatever is released, the cynics and the skeptics, myself included, will be a lot more critical of something promised to be god's gift to the world.

Believe me, I want to see a good game. The only reason I get anxious about the way things have been going is because I want to know that the game I enjoyed (past tense) is still alive in some way shape or form within its sequel. But, the more I check back on the news (or lack of), the more disappointed I am in the progress that I'm not seeing--keyword seeing--and am compelled to turn my attention elsewhere. My opinion on it is slowly transitioning from "I can't wait till they release it so I can buy it" to "if I see it on the shelf one day I might buy it," and I would wager there are a least a few others who share that perspective, which results in what I think is a poor choice on the part of the developers.

If they drop a bomb though, like everyone claims they will, my interest will be renewed. For now, release date is a non-issue until I can see some part it is what it is they plan on releasing.

Faer · Feb 15, 2009, 04:16 AM // 04:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crunk N Monkey

First its NO CONTENT. Now its ITS NOT ENOUGH.

Zone names and concept art are not content, sorry. I could draw something in MSPaint and call it "LAND OF POO" and claim it's from a game I'm developing. It'd be just as meaningless as the things you spoke of. It doesn't prove anything at all, and right now ArenaNet either needs to prove their development is going along as they say it is, or stop talking about the development.

Regina said she played the game, right? What game? I don't see a game. Maybe it's there, maybe it isn't. But you know what? Saying you have a Benjamin in your wallet but never pulling it out isn't going to win you any brownie points with people. Not smart people, anyway.

shoyon456 · Feb 15, 2009, 04:49 AM // 04:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Curseman

ArenaNet was founded by ex Blizzard employees, and they know what they're doing. It was said earlier that no one thinks the lack of Starcraft 1 updates over the past years will harm Starcraft 2's sales.

May be founded by ex Blizzard employees, but they aren't Blizzard. People know that Starcraft 2 being produced what, around a decade from the original?, won't hurt sales because the Blizzard name is worth $$$ and carries reputation along with the Starcraft name itself. The same thing goes for Diablo3.

Anet got lucky with one series, however you cannot draw a direct comparison between anet's success and the success of other mmo's because of the one time buy thing. Anet will not release the number of active accnts, because it would only hurt them.

However, It is important to realize that simply getting a really vague release year is a big step for anet, similar to an alcoholic admitting he's an alcoholic. But then again, anet's rep has seriously gone downhill, I mean BETA in '08? That was a slipup, and I won't take their word on this date or GW2 at all.

daze · Feb 15, 2009, 04:57 AM // 04:57

WTB Guild Wars Utopia.

Wild Rituals · Feb 15, 2009, 05:06 AM // 05:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by daze

WTB Guild Wars Utopia.

This.

Actually Reading the entire thread is rather boring its good at the start getting crap towards the middle then towards the end its a quote war with the usual GW2 arguments with 1 person trying to take on everyone else and usually its not even the whole peice of text they have a problem with its part of it

What happened to a person having their own opinion, actually wait this is guild wars guru nvm no1 can without getting quoted told off and argued against.

Gw2 will be out when its out
the fight for More news has been adressed how many times by anet staff?
they dont want to release info about something because if they do others might go oooohhhhhh must have, then that screws anet out of an idea.
So if ur that worried about a game release you are obviously sad.

I dont know why the guru people dont just add a GW2 Cryfest Section so we dont have all these annoyingly stupid GW2 threads glossing riverside?

Just play the game or dont play it, stop f*c*k*n* complaining about it being dead, not having anything to do, u being bad

my question is

umad?

Gigashadow · Feb 15, 2009, 05:08 AM // 05:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Faer

Zone names and concept art are not content, sorry. I could draw something in MSPaint and call it "LAND OF POO" and claim it's from a game I'm developing. It'd be just as meaningless as the things you spoke of. It doesn't prove anything at all, and right now ArenaNet either needs to prove their development is going along as they say it is, or stop talking about the development.

Regina said she played the game, right? What game? I don't see a game. Maybe it's there, maybe it isn't. But you know what? Saying you have a Benjamin in your wallet but never pulling it out isn't going to win you any brownie points with people. Not smart people, anyway.

So what exactly are you going to do when ArenaNet completely ignores your forum demands? Cut yourself?

-Sonata- · Feb 15, 2009, 05:27 AM // 05:27

I don't hold loyalty to Game Companies. I hold loyalty to great games. Guild Wars is a great game.

I spent two years in it and for those two years I had a blast. I accomplished all I wanted to accomplish. I saw and experienced all the things I desired to experience. It brought many hours of enjoyment and I don't regret a single moment of it.

However, all good things come to an end on a personal level. Even if Guild Wars 2 was to be released by years end it would not have stopped me from walking away and moving onto another game. It happens. There's only so much I can do before the redundant feeling comes into play. It had to come at some point. Two years for it to arrive was a long time. It was a great two years.

I don't blame Anet, or hold a grudge for that. I was not under any impressions that upon my purchase I would be spending a decade within the realm. I'm sure Anet doesn't hold a grudge against me for walking away either and why should they? For two years they provided me with a service that was well worth my investment.

When Guild Wars 2 comes out, my purchase won't be determined by the development name behind it, nor GW1's success. The determining factor will be, "Is it a great game and worth the investment?"

If the answer is yes, I'll be more than content to purchase it. If the answer is no, then no harm, no foul. I won't think anything more of it again.

Maybe it's because I don't marry into a gaming relationship with developing companies. I'm not sure. I've never been abe to figure out where some of this bitterness comes from. It's like the war of Sony players Vs. Xbox players. Can't I just play what I enjoy? You bet I can. So what if my best friend had the Atari? I far more enjoyed my Intellivision even if the game-slips for the joystick never fit right because of bent edges!

Do I support Anet more than I shake my head at them? Certainly. Compared to the junk filled market we currently have, they've done an outstanding job. Do I think they're God-Like who do no wrong? Hell no. No company is perfect, no person is perfect, no game is perfect. Even the King Kong Blizzard screws up and has shown to be ill-prepared with WoW content releases in the past. And if anyone thinks the WoW forums are filled with Sunshine and Rainbows of praise 24/7.......................

But because I enjoyed Anets product this time, should I self-impose restrictions on myself, or criteria for when and what reasons I can move on? Should I hang on by threads because I spent so much time in Tyria?Absolutely not. I may be a Sadist, but that's pushing the limits. I don't watch movies that I no longer enjoy. I don't read books I no longer enjoy. I don't partake in activities I no longer enjoy. I don't play games I no longer enjoy. That's not a diss at Anet, or Guild Wars. It's just a fact of life.

2010, 2011, 2015...Matters not to me when it hits the store shelves. As long as it's good I'll be there. If it's not good, I'll be somewhere else like now. No complex decisions, no heart break, no regrets of GW1, great memories always alive. I think I've said that plenty of times over the months. I just want a well made, well polished, cared for game.

Nightow · Feb 15, 2009, 05:30 AM // 05:30

Utopia would have made the game even more complex. Plus, we already have what was made of Utopia before they canceled it, it's in GWEN.

I'l agree with what others have said, concept art isn't really content, at least not what most would consider good or solid content. The head honchos obviously have some grand, master plan and part of it is to keep this good, solid content under lock and key. Regina has done her part in making them aware of what the fans would like but it most likely contradicts with their plan for GW2. We can whine and bicker and throw insults at each other 'til we're blue in the face. Will it make a difference? Heck no. All we can do is keep reminding those head honcho of what we want as fans and wait (maybe patiently for some of us...) until the time is right.

I mean, it's not like telling bickering on the internet will get us closer to GW 2 or anything...

Red Sonya · Feb 15, 2009, 05:47 AM // 05:47

Considering it took 3 chapters and an expansion and a mini expansion to reach those nearly 6 million sales it still doesn't come close to Diablo II which did 5 million with just one main story and one expansion. I predicted long ago this was going to happen and this law suit could very well be the end of NCsoft and Anet if/when the plantiffs win. By having to do 3 full chapters and one full expansion and one mini expansion the developers had to put in way more time than the developers of Diablo 2, thus more profit all around for the Blizzard folks who still make the best action rpg around. (can't wait for Diablo III woohoo). I've since moved on to playing "Mount & Blade" you guys should try this game it's a lot more fun than GW now. The live action combat is much better than pressing some cookie cutter 1 2 3 for sure.

Apollo Smile · Feb 15, 2009, 06:07 AM // 06:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red Sonya

Considering it took 3 chapters and an expansion and a mini expansion to reach those nearly 6 million sales it still doesn't come close to Diablo II which did 5 million with just one main story and one expansion. I predicted long ago this was going to happen and this law suit could very well be the end of NCsoft and Anet if/when the plantiffs win. By having to do 3 full chapters and one full expansion and one mini expansion the developers had to put in way more time than the developers of Diablo 2, thus more profit all around for the Blizzard folks who still make the best action rpg around. (can't wait for Diablo III woohoo). I've since moved on to playing "Mount & Blade" you guys should try this game it's a lot more fun than GW now. The live action combat is much better than pressing some cookie cutter 1 2 3 for sure.

A sequel to an incredibly popular Blizzard game selling more than a new franchise put out by a new company?! My word! That argument needs to be saved for when Guild Wars 2 comes out.

Stich · Feb 15, 2009, 07:41 AM // 07:41

1.5-2 years from now ?
Don't think i still will be on the barricades .

RedNova88 · Feb 15, 2009, 08:46 AM // 08:46

Red Sonya, Blizzard was/is incredibly popular which is explanation as to why Diablo 2 and other games sold so well. That, and they were pretty damn awesome for their time. However, this does not just magically make Blizzard superior to Anet, not that it matters if they were even. As for your comment about mashing 123 and so on, that's because of the community, at least mostly. Rarely do people try to come up with their own build anymore, they rush over to wiki for the latest FoTM build for X activity.

Cacheelma, you are right, it IS retarded that someone would play a game that they no longer enjoy. However, you'd be surprised if you played WoW for as long as I have, you'd find an awful lot of people that only play because they feel they have an obligation to do so for their guild. Openly saying they are tired of the game, but don't want to miss a raid with their friends. Not that I'm saying WoW is bad, which it's not, it's amazing in it's own ways. One of the strengths of Guild Wars has always been the no obligation due to monthly fees. I've quit GW several times and keep coming back for the same reasons I bought the game to begin with.

"On the subject of the GW2 release, I've always been of the opinion that if you hype something up or build expectations too high, you will have made yourself quite the high hurdle to overcome on release day."

I also have to strongly agree with this, if you create too much hype for a game and it bombs. People tend to follow the flock when they're disappointed, that's why I think games like AoC and such are not doing great. While on the other hand Lord of the Rings Online didn't really hype up much at all, and yet here it is slowly gaining on the top dogs of the race. My friends call it "The best MMO that nobody plays" which actually ends up being a good thing, because it has a tight knit community as apposed to a flock of angsty teens fighting about religion in general chat.

Society · Feb 15, 2009, 09:53 AM // 09:53

He-he, and it was awited new info... So, people which hopes to play GW2 before their death is still with us ?

Fril Estelin · Feb 15, 2009, 09:56 AM // 09:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Faer

dangling a carrot in front of a starving horse.

Don't all the people in this situation ("starving horse") realise it's time to move on with GW1, forget it and play another game? Someone already said this before: if Anet releases anything (at all), people will thank them, very quickly scrutinise it to the molecular level, and then complain that a) it's not enough; 2) it's not consistent with X, Y and Z; 3) if they tell us that, they should also tell us these other things. And 6 months later people would still be "starting horsse" and calling the information given previously a "carrot" that Anet is using to "force" them to buy GW2.

Meanwhile, each piece of news is read by competitors like Activision Blizzard, which will be prepared to rip the idea to piecs by putting 10 times the resources Anet has in order to make it look more shiny and put a PR spin like no one else can. Talking yesterday with Martin confirmed this idea that GW's business model is so different and (somewhat) sustainable that it's even ok to loose people for a little while, it follows the original vision of GW: play it, have fun, then put it aside, only to come back later (for GW2). (note this is not what Martin said exactly, and I interpret) People are automatically "attached" to the game due to the fact it's good and f2p. Anet doesn't have to tie you to a monthly commitment (a.k.a. payment).

In a sense, this thread is the result of the game being "overplayed". I don't have the problem people mention because I can still play at my own pace for 2 years without a problem. This is impossible for players who've done "everything" (whatever that means for the player: PvE areas, PvP games, both, GWAMM, etc.) several times and who are already on the starting blocks for GW2, 1-2 years too early. It's a two sided-coin: on one side casual see something good (I've got more time to play GW1 until I'll play GW2), on the other side non-casual players don't like the fact they'll have to wait (second-guessing whatever atom of information Anet/NCsoft is throwing around).

Anyway, this thread and most GW2-related threads have jumped the shark a few months ago on Guru. They're mostly an emotion-relief mechanisms (which is not bad by itself) or an opportunity to QQ or troll. If you look at the posts presenting the business side of the argument, it makes the rest look void and empty. For GW2 to be a success, Anet has a business strategy that requires making a big difference in 1-2 years, as they did 4 years ago with GW1.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Faer

It doesn't prove anything at all, and right now ArenaNet either needs to prove their development is going along as they say it is, or stop talking about the development.

They don't need to proove anything at all, it's a business, not a scientific lecture.

Quote:

Regina said she played the game, right? What game? I don't see a game. Maybe it's there, maybe it isn't. But you know what? Saying you have a Benjamin in your wallet but never pulling it out isn't going to win you any brownie points with people. Not smart people, anyway.

Martin also said that to me yesterday, he played the game and it's brilliant. Nuff said.

sky sliverwolf · Feb 15, 2009, 10:04 AM // 10:04

Umm we get to play the game for 1 year, yes 1 year. The world is going to end in 2012! So enjoy it

lol lol

Society · Feb 15, 2009, 10:20 AM // 10:20

Quote:

Martin also said that to me yesterday, he played the game and it's brilliant. Nuff said.

So brilliant, that they can't even release that piece of epic awesomeness before Apocalypse ? Nuff said.
Oh, and BTW:

Quote:

Hm, I said I had played GW2, but I did not give any indication as to it's level of polish.

Regina, please, it's not even funny anymore:
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...&postcount=262

Quote:

It hasn't reached the level of polish where we want to show it off just yet

I understand, it's really hard times to you, advertising air really takes nerves when people begin to understant what's going on... It's like walking on the edge of abyss. But even if it makes you nervous and shaking, gathering accuracy is critical... Just a friendly tip.

Fril Estelin · Feb 15, 2009, 10:58 AM // 10:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Society

So brilliant, that they can't even release that piece of epic awesomeness before Apocalypse ? Nuff said.

Well, you see, there are two point of views here:

1) the player one, which is short term, where Anet pleases players by showing them bits of info about GW2, while other companies get to know what to expect of GW2 in 1-2 years, thus having the time (Activision Blizzard has 10 times the human resources of Anet and probably more financially) to put the idea into their game before GW2 hits the market (or publicise the idea, or a similar one, in their next game);

2) the company one, where they're trying to survive in an increasingly difficult market (see NCsoft Europe recent redundancies) and with big games coming out in the next 1-2 years; and here, you have to sacrifice the short-term pleasure of pleasing (part of) your playerbase with GW2 info, for a long-term success of this next game you're building with the highest hopes in the world.

I'm not sure there's a third option here, any "small" piece of information (like artwork) is going to give clues, and opportunities to be copied (e.g. if you see, say, a chronomancer, you'll see similar ideas popping around). And as I said above, it's going to make the community (well, sort of, most non-Guru players won't care and they're the majority) angrier and asking for more. It surely was a mistake to publish so much stuff about GW2 1year+ ago, but what is done is done. People will judge Anet kindly or nicely, they'll leave the game or keep playing it (from time to time), but I don't see the point of constantly beating the dead horse. (or is it another attempt to try to force Anet to change its mind? even if it means it may harm the potential for GW2 to be a success in 1-2 years?)

Society · Feb 15, 2009, 11:31 AM // 11:31

Just_info:
Ever heard about Ankama ? Well, they developed their Wakfy MMOTRPG, sequel of of Dofus, up to open beta stage at end 2008, whil still working on Dofus (released, constaly receiving content updates), Dofus arena (open Beta) and Waku-based maga. Work on Wakfu was started after (AFAIK) GW2 announce, it was developed on completely new, Ankama-created engine. Ah, and they constaly relaes scrennshots ant art all that time. Yes, it has unique world and gameplay features.
;End_info

Quote:

big games coming out in the next 1-2 years

Big games is always coming. Before and after 1-2 years. It isn't excuse.

Quote:

and here, you have to sacrifice the short-term pleasure of pleasing (part of) your playerbase with GW2 info, for a long-term success of this next game you're building with the highest hopes in the world.

Oh, BTW.... Success ? No1 guaranteed it, even if release will really come in 2011-2012. Market is upredictable.

Quote:

e.g. if you see, say, a chronomancer, you'll see similar ideas popping around

Grrr... If you are talking about Chronomancer class in Finite Height, it's mostly my own design, inspired by FFT's Time Mages and Lusternia's High Magic skillset. Well, basically that idea was floating around from Bard's Tale III times.

Quote:

It surely was a mistake to publish so much stuff about GW2 1year+ ago, but what is done is done.

Why ? That stuff means nothing anyways. Basically, it more resemble some fan-speculations then official info.

Quote:

And as I said above, it's going to make the community (well, sort of, most non-Guru players won't care and they're the majority) angrier and asking for more

So, why not give more info periodically (2 weaks, f.e.) ? It's how marketing works, BTW. Clues for ideas ? Come on, I'm personally can generate concepts of GW-like universes every 2 days.... Being just amateur designer yet. So, no one really going to steal ideas, it's just stupid and useless.

Quote:

(or is it another attempt to try to force Anet to change its mind? even if it means it may harm the potential for GW2 to be a success in 1-2 years?)

Releasing things is impossible if you just lack them, so it's absolutely useless to demand info from ANet. I just dislike when people openly lying to me.

Fril Estelin · Feb 15, 2009, 12:11 PM // 12:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Society

Releasing things is impossible if you just lack them, so it's absolutely useless to demand info from ANet. I just dislike when people openly lying to me.

So you would KNOW that they are lying? And I guess you've got no proof of that! (so we're on par, we both have opinions! but I can name Regina, Martin and some NCsoft executives saying they have seen GW2...let's no got back to the vaporware argument/thread which was closed...) Oh and check GW utopia artwork for chronomancers. Btw do you have a marketing degree? If so, how much amount of practical marketing do you have in your CV?

Why do people want GW2 information so badly?
1) because they have to put money aside so that they can buy the game in 1-2 years?
2) because they have to plan what next games they'll be playing and want to add GW2 to their 1-2 years schedule? or decide when to stop playing GW1?
3) as a matter of principle, because it's not cool to not have information (the fear of silence), or you have to have an informed opinion and decide whether Anet can be trusted or not?
4) because it's cool to bash Anet on forums or create artificial arguments?